"The basic problem of our world is that it is ruled by 20-sometings that loath working on "old" tech. The epitome of this is the FOSS world that goes through a wrenching rewrite churn every 5 years or so as new heads take over "old" projects."
Disagree thoroughly. The reason why people push shit through the security-updates channel is because of money and structural pressure from management to ensure adoption of the company's new $THING.
It's funny that I see the general sentiment over Windows 10 to be the opposite of Python 3. "Everyone" is mad Microsoft pushed Windows 10 too hard, meanwhile "everyone" is trying to get people to adopt Python 3 and wondering why it took big name libraries so long to convert.
It's a big problem in tech, trying to get people to update. We might like to think of ourselves as progressive, but a lot of people in our world tend to be very conservative and resistant to change. Microsoft knows that as well as anyone else. The only way to ensure people are using the latest version is to stop giving them a choice. You can't always rely on people making the best choice for themselves.
That sounds super authoritarian, sure, but the nice thing about technology? Microsoft isn't the only game in town. They can do whatever they want with their platform and you're free to leave. You don't need a passport, or any more money, or really even any additional knowledge at this point. You're only locked in if you choose to be locked in.
*with "everyone" being the typical Internet strawman that only actually exists in a random selection of HN comments.
I'm not really seeing the corollary between Windows and Python in regards to new versions and the requiredness thereof. Windows is proprietary and has a cost, and customers of it have a business relationship with Microsoft. Python, by contrast, is free and libre, and is offered with no warranty implied. If the lack of support for Python 2 is proving to be an inconvenience for you and you won't upgrade to Python 3 for whatever reason, well then, all the source is available, and you can do the needful. Hell, you can even build, release, and distribute your own fork of Python 2 that gets continued updates. None of these options are available with Windows.
The only way to ensure people are using the latest version is to stop giving them a choice. You can't always rely on people making the best choice for themselves.
Agree with the first part, the second needs a very twisted definition of best or themselves.
Offer something people want and they will upgrade. This alone tells very much about the win10 situation.
Microsoft game is lock-in, if the cost of leaving their garden is trivial they are doing something wrong!
I have a friend who buys $20 shoes. They last him a year, and then he has to buy another pair of shoes. He laughs when I buy $70 shoes, but those $70 shoes last me four years. Over that four year period, he's spent $80 on shoes and I spent $70.
I have a friend who buys $500 laptops. They last him a year, and then he has to buy another laptop. He laughs when I buy $1000 laptops, but those $1000 laptops last me three years. Over that three year period, he's spent $1500 on laptops and I spent $1000.
I have a friend who uses Windows XP. Windows XP is better, it's faster, it's leaner, Aero is garbage, Metro is garbage. DirectX 12 is just a scam to get you to upgrade, there's no reason Windows XP isn't the best. But once a month he's calling me about some kind of virus he's gotten even though he runs Symantec every day.
Relying on an outdated piece of software is never the best decision. If Microsoft's updates bother you that much, stop using Microsoft software. Microsoft can't lock you in to anything, and there's very little that Windows offers that OSX, or to a lesser extent Linux, doesn't offer. The arguments against switching come down to "I hate Apple/Linux", in which case you've locked yourself into one vendor for irrational reasons, or "Apple is too expensive", in which case you have to wonder if that's actually true considering you're spending hours complaining about Microsoft updates, or the worst one, "I'm a Windows developer", which... why? If you hate Microsoft enough to want to switch but Visual Studio is the only thing holding you back, I don't feel bad for you. The only slightly legitimate complaint is the lack of games, but there are a ton of games for Mac these days and consoles do exist.
It's not really lock-in if you choose to be locked in.
Windows comes preinstalled on most PCs, you are being disingenuous if you say that is not a major factor. MS was ruled to violate antitrust laws regarding web browsers. How is that for a lock in if you can just download Netscape?
The arguments against switching come down to "I hate Apple/Linux"
Not at all. Many people are forced to use MS software, they don't have a choice. Not just running Windows, but using various MS Office apps, formats, Skype etc.
Also, there are others (mainly elderly) who are only familiar with Windows, learning another platform is not a freebie for everyone.
Most apps people need have alternatives on other platforms, but there are many - besides games, that target Windows only. Well, VS being the bloatware it is, not one of them of course.
> But once a month he's calling me about some kind of virus he's gotten even though he runs Symantec every day.
You've identified a source of inefficiency in his workflow. If he really hates everything after XP though, maybe it's better (more efficient) to handle a big problem once a month than a dozen little problems (disliking aspects of the tool he's using) every day.
> "I'm a Windows developer", which... why?
That seems like an easy answer, though. Because someone's paying me to work on the technology that they want to use, which may be very different from the technology that I decide to use on my own time. Things can be personally suboptimal, but professionally useful. You don't hate it, but you don't love it as much as the things you use on your home machines.
> Relying on an outdated piece of software is never the best decision. If Microsoft's updates bother you that much, stop using Microsoft software. Microsoft can't lock you in to anything, and there's very little that Windows offers that OSX, or to a lesser extent Linux, doesn't offer.
Using software that actively works against your best interests, even while acting in your best interests in other ways, without a way to separate the two...is never the best decision. Microsoft can't lock you in, but platform choices of other developers can.
On a separate point about OSX: One thing it won't ever offer is the ability to run it on my hardware of choice. I happily pay Apple-like prices for hardware configured in ways that Apple doesn't offer.
> The only slightly legitimate complaint is the lack of games, but there are a ton of games for Mac these days and consoles do exist.
Games aren't fungible. Mac and Linux support lots of games, including what I was playing last night. Sometimes, what I want to play is limited to a single platform, and that platform is one that I wouldn't choose for general-use. C'est la vie.
> It's not really lock-in if you choose to be locked in.
That sounds like one of the arguments I've heard to justify things like TSA searches, or the various statements from politicians saying that internet access isn't a necessity and shouldn't be considered a right. "You don't have to fly! You can drive! No driver's license? You can bike!" Well...right. You don't "have" to use Windows, because you don't "have" to make software that works with Windows. It's your own choice to target customers using the most-used PC OS in existence.
Disagree thoroughly. The reason why people push shit through the security-updates channel is because of money and structural pressure from management to ensure adoption of the company's new $THING.